Cyan 2 weaker than cyan1

[Big_Dog_II]

@Reveille - I don't think anyone is disagreeing with that statement. However, at Cyan the boosts with enchantment have almost exponentially increased vs other rarities. I'll argue that losing 9 expertise isn't a real deal breaker and something that can be overcome with re-runing.

However, when characters lose 700+ dodge, it is a stat change that cannot be overcome within the meta. In addition, it actually made some characters really interesting (e.g. Kaiju) when the opposing characters needed to have an accuracy boost to counteract the dodge. This gave the game an added dimension of strategy and, at least at the onset of cyan, made war interesting again for a couple weeks.

[rfgcdfdhuf]

I think you are looking on heroes promotion in wrong way, heroes are being designed around unenchanted items because those stats will be carried on.

Your argument (as some thers from the side ow "weak cyan+2" camp) seems to miss that point of enchantment system - it allows to make some extremes on current rank.
But everyone take full enchanted hero as granted.

Of course Inadequate dodge mechanic brings more rock-paper-scissors approach (more extreme interaction: A can kill B or A can't do anything to B) than the more classical "more beef more damage" (raising numbers, heroes just go stronger) but the fact stays still - diferrent promotions offer different stats that you will have to operate with.
Just don't promote heroes if you think they are weaker on full enchanted cyan +2 than on cyan +1 and wait what cyan +3 will offer - that's a valid strategy.

[Big_Dog_II]

heroes are being designed around unenchanted items

Personally, I think this is giving too much credit to those making decisions around the heroes.

Just don't promote heroes if you think they are weaker on full enchanted cyan +2

Yes, this has been mentioned and will be followed by many players. Our guild is already having discussions about who benefits from promotion and who doesn't. It doesn't make it right and, once again, leaves open the question as to whether this is intentional.

[rfgcdfdhuf]

Maybe @DSSven could make an appearance and take a note on those as it was still their chapter

Who knows

[Warrior_Draco]

Too many people jump at the sight of a red Dot and then complain that their heroes are weaker. Lol

[Unasz]

Actually is there any toons that are better on C2 (with full equip and enchant) than a full enchanted C1?

[rfgcdfdhuf]

Actually yes.
Literally every hero, who doesn't build around high expertise (mask/scroll with +30 expertise on cyan/cyan+1) or have BunnyBlade+TinFoil combo will be stronger on cyan +2.

Complains are exactly because people were investing in those two types heavily (because it's obviously on meta) and can't relate what to do now when situation is not just "promote everything you have - get stronger toons".

[Sp1tfire]

I think everyone knows what to do. Don't promote heroes that lose tons of expertise and dodge. They are still the meta even if you keep them at c+1. There's not a single hero outside the meta that suddenly becomes part of the meta because it has great gear at c+2.

[Unasz]

Some also loses couple hundred magic penetration as well, dracul and wee for example.
Im so damn lazy to calculate one by one, thats why im asking if someone might have done it

[rfgcdfdhuf]

But that doesn't change the fact that most heroes are still stonger statwise on cyan+2, isn't it?

IMHO dodge-accuracy interaction should be changed from linear to diminishing returns type, like any other mechanic.
It's really hard balance out that way.

[Sp1tfire]

How are they still stronger? I beat lvl 140 cyan+2 teams in coli with level 136 c+1 teams. If anything, they seem to die faster than before. So they seem to perform worse, regardless of what stats they gained from c+2.

[rfgcdfdhuf]

Armor and magic resist are really weak in DS, so does the penetrations for them aswell.
Barely a loss if you ask me.

[Unasz]

Thats why i have concerns as well, unless its the dust devil exploit abusing line i literally beat the sh.t out of c2 lines with my c1-ers, some even o6 or o8

[rfgcdfdhuf]

Tha't not valid comparison, valid comparison would be looking 1on1 cyan+1 vs cyan +2 hero with same runes.
Most cyan +2 heroes will win their counterparts.

TBH I've promoted my corgi to +2 and he still dodges everything, so I'm not sure that dodge heroes on +2 as bad as people do picture it. I need some more test to cosider promoting my archer thief and bard thought.

Cyan+2 is obviously won't give you some real power upgrade, it's just plateu promotion in comparison to cyan +1.
I still believe it's cyan+1 fault, those double dodge items was bad desicion, as well as cognitive mask.

[Sp1tfire]

Tha't not valid comparison, valid comparison would be looking 1on1 cyan+1 vs cyan +2 hero with same runes.
Most cyan +2 heroes will win their counterparts.

Which never happens in daily use and it's not important.I usually hit same players and use the same teams that I was using while they were c+1. If it's easier to beat them now when they are c+2 and my heroes are still c+1, it kinda proves c+2 gives you no benefit for those heroes, except for bragging you have more health, but useless, because you die faster.

[rfgcdfdhuf]

And I have no problems wiping out enemy teams with my cyan +2 composition compared to them being cyan+1 aswell, regardles what promotions enemies are.

Actually my wolf now oneshots almost everyone except thief and tanks which wasn't a thing before.

[Conky]

Are you serious? The answer is in my post. Improve everyone while improving SOME heroes more than others.

[Maie]

j ai tester beaucoup de 1vs1.....cyan1 vs cyan2... meme rune.... cyan 1 semble meilleur excepter sur les heros physiques... cyan 2 semblent mieux

[Big_Dog_II]

...and still no comment from the dev team.

[Warrior_Draco]

What y'all haven't grasped yet is just because some have the level to fully equip and enchant at C2 doesn't mean they have yet.